I understand the perspective of the generals but I wonder whether they are both have that perspective because there doctrinal basis has been corrupted as it relies either on old Soviet doctrine or skewed NATO doctrine from the 1st and 2nd Gulf Wars and GWOT. And they are too focused on the battlefield to see the wider area.
Lobbying missiles or interceptors into the air to stop missile and drones is not a long term winning prospect well it certainly isn't a quick way to win the war.
Ukraine needs its hands untied so it can launch the necessary attacks on the Centres of Gravity of Russia. Even with all the F-16s in the world, unless they are able to launch strikes at will in Russia on the Russian CoGs, it is going to be a long war.
Not to say Ukraine doesn't need more or doesn't need to have heavy equipment and bigger airforce. It definitely needs that to launch the offensives to take advantage of degrading and destroying CoGs but it really needs to come with the untying the hands of Ukraine to strike Russia CoGs at will without asking for permission.
Yes, Shankar-“Always gloriously late.” Those simple words are too true! My mind was screaming with the question “where are the F-16s” shortly after the war began! Yeah, yeah… I know that Ukraine wasn’t/isn’t a member of NATO… Blah blah blah! They needed the F 16s a long time ago!
And yes, Ukraine needs to engage in massive retaliation!
Europe is feeling Putin snapping at its heels. The Baltics are making defensive preparations for war. Finland is always ready (great tunnels), Poland is nervous. And that is a list of the most obviously threatened countries. Then there was the second drone that wandered over Vilnius in the last few days. Accident? More likely provocation. I think Europe is really feeling the threat from Russia. I hope this is enough to shake them into giving Ukraine what it needs for victory. Europe knows Russia cannot remain a sleeping giant. Putin wants Lebensraum. England and France see the threat of a wider war.
The big question is whether Trump can be kept on track. Caine and co. Seem to know what is what. But can they keep the leader persuaded?
It has helped Europe gain perspective on its own vulnerabilities when U.S. systems have suddenly been turned off. Or when Trump declares Russia and Ukraine simply have to duke it out like schoolchildren. The U.S. is unreliable. And currently it is purely transactional when it is in a helpful mood Cash on the barrel head. And there is also a potential for political chaos in the U.S. which might also cut off assistance . Europe now sees what it is dealing with—Macron, Merz and Starmer are not fools. There are some additional notable players who will probably keep things on course. I pray I am right. The warnings from top generals should provide a good kick in the backside to any dithering on the sidelines. Ramp up or end up in a full scale war on your own territory, not just Ukraine.
There are other things Europe could do: Enforce the sanctions already in place on Russia. Close the Baltic to Russia's "shadow fleet" (really close it). Impose additional economic pressure on China to reduce its aid to Putin. Stop buying Russian fossil fuels.
Love this. "And rest not until the goal is reached." A different war. I am close to finishing "The Kindly Ones," by Jonathan Littell Five nights in a row Berlin is hammered by the allies bombs and threats...........the war carries on but not until everyone, the Allies, join forces in full effect does the war end. You are on target Shankar. This is what we need now. Putins bark of war yesterday can't have us bow down. I am not a war hawk, After the war in Ukraine began I did a genealogic search a good part of my family lived in the area of Ivano-Frankivsk Oblast. I want to go back and see the land in which they lived and maybe stay. Glory for Ukraine!
They can deliver deep strike ordnance at supersonic or high subsonic speeds at 50,000 ft (or more). The latest blocks (which I didn’t get to fly) can launch an AMRAAM against an air target beyond their radar detection range, based on data fed to it by an AWACS, and immediately execute a 180 to exit the threat’s range. Both are tech improvements over the Soviet era fighters in Ukraine’s inventory from before the war.
But think of the F-16 not as a weapon, but as a weapon delivery system. A streaming supply of deep strike air launched missiles, HARM (anti-radiation - SAM suppression) or, powered JDAMs is necessary. Without enough of the needed ordinance, the F-16s can put on a great air show.
Shankar’s list;
* Full-spectrum air defense systems—long-, mid-, and short-range
* Drone interceptors
* Long-range strike weapons
* F-16s
was good, but to shred Russia’s ability to continue the war, 1) long range strike weapons should have appeared twice on the list (stealthy, where possible) and, 2) solid intelligence on Putin’s drone and missile construction industry sites must be readily available for targeting. “You gotta take out the damn archers !!”
Addendum. I have a recently retired three-star Air Force acquaintance who I respect. Immediately after Dan Caine’s appointment as Chair of JCS, I checked with him for info on the guy. His response has given me confidence that has so far held up.
Hi Shankar … can you please explain how F16s can provide a long range strike capability? They are not stealth fighters so cannot progress far into Russia. They can launch Storm Shadow/SCALP and/or Taurus which gives them an effective 500km strike radius - is this what you mean?
I thought Ukrainian drones were already having a remarkable and powerful long range effect. I note also that Ukrainian hackers have just brought down the whole of the Aeroflot server-system and, not inconsequentially, the Russian equivalent of social services and pensions etc. - also pretty powerful long range effects.
Mother Nature, too, has just supplied an earthquake and tsunami to (allegedly) have taken out Russia’s only nuclear missile-carrying submarine base ( in Kamchatka). Very helpful!
Ukraine seems to be doing quite well at the moment?
I feel the need to recommend the sub stackers Lev Parnas and Oleksander Bolbirer to understand how Ukraine is not doing quite well at the moment -for anyone who is truly unaware.
I understand the perspective of the generals but I wonder whether they are both have that perspective because there doctrinal basis has been corrupted as it relies either on old Soviet doctrine or skewed NATO doctrine from the 1st and 2nd Gulf Wars and GWOT. And they are too focused on the battlefield to see the wider area.
Lobbying missiles or interceptors into the air to stop missile and drones is not a long term winning prospect well it certainly isn't a quick way to win the war.
Ukraine needs its hands untied so it can launch the necessary attacks on the Centres of Gravity of Russia. Even with all the F-16s in the world, unless they are able to launch strikes at will in Russia on the Russian CoGs, it is going to be a long war.
Not to say Ukraine doesn't need more or doesn't need to have heavy equipment and bigger airforce. It definitely needs that to launch the offensives to take advantage of degrading and destroying CoGs but it really needs to come with the untying the hands of Ukraine to strike Russia CoGs at will without asking for permission.
Yes.
👏🔥
Yes, Shankar-“Always gloriously late.” Those simple words are too true! My mind was screaming with the question “where are the F-16s” shortly after the war began! Yeah, yeah… I know that Ukraine wasn’t/isn’t a member of NATO… Blah blah blah! They needed the F 16s a long time ago!
And yes, Ukraine needs to engage in massive retaliation!
Europe is feeling Putin snapping at its heels. The Baltics are making defensive preparations for war. Finland is always ready (great tunnels), Poland is nervous. And that is a list of the most obviously threatened countries. Then there was the second drone that wandered over Vilnius in the last few days. Accident? More likely provocation. I think Europe is really feeling the threat from Russia. I hope this is enough to shake them into giving Ukraine what it needs for victory. Europe knows Russia cannot remain a sleeping giant. Putin wants Lebensraum. England and France see the threat of a wider war.
The big question is whether Trump can be kept on track. Caine and co. Seem to know what is what. But can they keep the leader persuaded?
It has helped Europe gain perspective on its own vulnerabilities when U.S. systems have suddenly been turned off. Or when Trump declares Russia and Ukraine simply have to duke it out like schoolchildren. The U.S. is unreliable. And currently it is purely transactional when it is in a helpful mood Cash on the barrel head. And there is also a potential for political chaos in the U.S. which might also cut off assistance . Europe now sees what it is dealing with—Macron, Merz and Starmer are not fools. There are some additional notable players who will probably keep things on course. I pray I am right. The warnings from top generals should provide a good kick in the backside to any dithering on the sidelines. Ramp up or end up in a full scale war on your own territory, not just Ukraine.
I totally agree!
There are other things Europe could do: Enforce the sanctions already in place on Russia. Close the Baltic to Russia's "shadow fleet" (really close it). Impose additional economic pressure on China to reduce its aid to Putin. Stop buying Russian fossil fuels.
https://theweek.com/business/economy/is-the-eu-funding-russia-more-than-ukraine
No time like the present. Let’s get after it boys.
Love this. "And rest not until the goal is reached." A different war. I am close to finishing "The Kindly Ones," by Jonathan Littell Five nights in a row Berlin is hammered by the allies bombs and threats...........the war carries on but not until everyone, the Allies, join forces in full effect does the war end. You are on target Shankar. This is what we need now. Putins bark of war yesterday can't have us bow down. I am not a war hawk, After the war in Ukraine began I did a genealogic search a good part of my family lived in the area of Ivano-Frankivsk Oblast. I want to go back and see the land in which they lived and maybe stay. Glory for Ukraine!
You will absolutely love it 💖
EU is chronically slow, they take ages to decide anything. Low energy there. It’s a little miracle what they are doing now, happy to see that!
Every time, I came back from visiting my parents in Prague, I feel the energy of the US, even at the airport and I am glad, this is my home!
I flew the F-16.
They can deliver deep strike ordnance at supersonic or high subsonic speeds at 50,000 ft (or more). The latest blocks (which I didn’t get to fly) can launch an AMRAAM against an air target beyond their radar detection range, based on data fed to it by an AWACS, and immediately execute a 180 to exit the threat’s range. Both are tech improvements over the Soviet era fighters in Ukraine’s inventory from before the war.
But think of the F-16 not as a weapon, but as a weapon delivery system. A streaming supply of deep strike air launched missiles, HARM (anti-radiation - SAM suppression) or, powered JDAMs is necessary. Without enough of the needed ordinance, the F-16s can put on a great air show.
Shankar’s list;
* Full-spectrum air defense systems—long-, mid-, and short-range
* Drone interceptors
* Long-range strike weapons
* F-16s
was good, but to shred Russia’s ability to continue the war, 1) long range strike weapons should have appeared twice on the list (stealthy, where possible) and, 2) solid intelligence on Putin’s drone and missile construction industry sites must be readily available for targeting. “You gotta take out the damn archers !!”
Addendum. I have a recently retired three-star Air Force acquaintance who I respect. Immediately after Dan Caine’s appointment as Chair of JCS, I checked with him for info on the guy. His response has given me confidence that has so far held up.
the taco guy needs to take back his order of ukraine not hitting russian oil supp;ies
What is your opinion on the article by Nick Paton Walsh on cnn website. He thinks Ukraine is getting hammered.
Hi Shankar … can you please explain how F16s can provide a long range strike capability? They are not stealth fighters so cannot progress far into Russia. They can launch Storm Shadow/SCALP and/or Taurus which gives them an effective 500km strike radius - is this what you mean?
I thought Ukrainian drones were already having a remarkable and powerful long range effect. I note also that Ukrainian hackers have just brought down the whole of the Aeroflot server-system and, not inconsequentially, the Russian equivalent of social services and pensions etc. - also pretty powerful long range effects.
Mother Nature, too, has just supplied an earthquake and tsunami to (allegedly) have taken out Russia’s only nuclear missile-carrying submarine base ( in Kamchatka). Very helpful!
Ukraine seems to be doing quite well at the moment?
What exactly is the contribution of the f-16's ? How do they increase range?
I feel the need to recommend the sub stackers Lev Parnas and Oleksander Bolbirer to understand how Ukraine is not doing quite well at the moment -for anyone who is truly unaware.